Mc to Mc: Questions from an Irishman

The Erwin McManus/Inland Community Church Connection



This past week I received some interesting (and completely unsolicitated) emails from a recent Erwin McManus conference attendee in Northern Ireland to my gmail account at yvonneneem@gmail.com. With the permission of the man who sent in these questions, I felt our "conversation" was worthy of sharing with my readers here at Solid Foods.

Emails from an Irishman:

Nov. 19
From Jonny M,

Hi was at a mens conference in Belfast, N Ireland on 17th Nov, just 2 days ago. As part of his presentation he said he had 2 million $ in the bank but just took on $5m of debt from some other organization. Maybe you could shed some light on this.Enjoyed your blog, he's a bit smoth for this Irishman!


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Nov. 20
Reply to Jonny M,

Thank you for your reply!

I don't know what conference this was (it's hard to keep up with everything) so I can't be sure what Erwin McManus was talking about but I do know that his church, Mosaic L.A., assumed a large debt when they bailed out Pastor Ralph Neighbor's Inland Community Church here in San Bernardino, California. Here is the excerpt about this from my post at Solid Foods - A Revisionist History of the Church on Brady?:

Sometime in February, 2007, the "Believe the Impossible" funds were used to pay off a second mortgage on the financially troubled Inland Community Church, one of the "daughter" churches of the original Church on Brady mentioned above. This property now belongs to Mosaic and has been renamed Mosaic Inland. It is still being used by the original "daughter" congregation. This property is located in San Bernardino County, a little more than 30 miles away from the original site on Brady Ave. in East L.A. and well beyond the original search parameters given to the donors at the fundraising banquet. Inland was floundering to survive after a scandal of it's own when it's parent church, Mosaic, decided to step in to help by paying off the second mortgage. From what I've heard, Inland is still struggling with low attendance.

I'm curious about something though, did Erwin say "he" had 2 million in the bank and took on 5 million in debt or did he say it was Mosaic that did this? Now that would be an interesting answer.

Thanks again for your response.

Yvonne W.



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Nov. 20
From Jonny M,

Hi Yvonne nice to hear from you, i wrote this mail after hours of research on Erwin McManus, it was pretty late and to the point, so if you don't mind i'll expand a bit. Heres a link to the conference I was at http://www.themandate.net/ , it's a one day event for men, about 4000 attended before i forget. So the main speaker was Erwin and between him and the praise band i came away really encouraged and uplifted. (Some background, I'm 32 married with 2 young kids, wouldn't say i'm a spiritual firebrand just an average guy, self employed and working every hour of daylight i can get! I come from quite a strict evangelical background with lots of strong Bible teaching, we attend a local Baptist church.) Anyway back to the subject, I bought his book barbarian way and was reading it before i left the building. I'm nearly finished it and was getting me really firedup. So i thought hold on, let's research this guy before I change the world single handidly. So i find maybe 80% of feedback on the net is negative. Then i found your website, you wouldn't be a part time detective by any chance!! the detail was amazing, so i'm thinking no smoke without a fire. So could you honestly give me an idea of what this guys reputation is like at home. I know the people i was with were really impressed by him but wouldn't be too happy if he was a fraud. Just how mixed up is he? Anyway if you can't answer these questions for reasons i don't need to know, i'll just keep reading your and others web sites. So before i finish, the bit about the money. An audio cd can be purchased form the website, the session was living the adventure part 3. This is where he said the church had $2m clear in the bank, but recently took on a debt of $7m, if i'm right that would leave $5m of debt. Did he say the church or his debt i'm not sure but the audio will tell. I feel kind of guilty saying all this now! Anyway reply soon and thanks for taking the time to reply in the first place



Jonathan Mc



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Nov. 20
Reply to Jonny M,

Jonny M,

I believe that 7 million debt was incurred when Mosaic L.A. assumed the 2nd mortgage for Inland Community Church. As I wrote before, Mosaic assumed the debt as "a favor" to Inland and it's pastor Ralph Neighbor; who happens to be one of Erwin McManus's most vocal supporters.

What I find interesting is that now, just a few short months after assuming this debt, you inform me that Erwin has begun to speak about it during his conference talks. May I ask you a question? In what context was this topic presented? Was it mentioned in passing? Did Erwin seem to be complaining about the debt? Did he ever mention Inland Community Church?

The reason I ask is because this 2nd mortgage was taken out on a very valuable piece of real estate in the city of Chino, San Bernardino county, California. The original Inland Community Church congregation purchased the land and buildings under the assumption that the congregation would continue to grow and thus bring in new revenue to pay off the original debt but unfortunately those hopes were dashed and worse, the church ended up further in debt due to large legal fees AND lost members due to the scandal.

With rising real estate values here in California, I wonder if the land/buildings are worth more than the outstanding debt. If so, it might be highly profitable to sell Mosaic Inland rather than keep the ailing church alive. Remember, in his early days back in Texas, this is exactly the sort of thing Erwin McManus was known for. If this were to occur, where would the money go? Would it go towards the purchase of a more appropriately sized property for the congregation in Chino or would the money go into the general fund for Mosaic L.A.? Keep in mind what happened to the funds raised by the original congregation of the Church on Brady.

So what if Inland was sold, what then? The congregation would have the option of joining one of the many other Mosaic clones here in California but what would happen to Pastor Ralph Neighbor? If you'll take the time to continue to read my blog and those of other ex-Mosaic members (links are available at Solid Foods) you'll soon see that Erwin McManus has left a long trail of discarded coworkers behind him.

Yvonne W.



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Nov. 21
Sent to Jonny M,

Jonny M.,

I've enjoyed writing to you on the topic of Erwin McManus and Inland Community Church. Your emails regarding Erwin's recent remarks at the conference in Belfast has certainly sparked my curiosity about why this issue of "indebtedness" has suddenly become worthy of mention from the pulpit.

I plan to comment on this topic in my blog, Solid Foods, and would like to quote from these emails.

I hope to hear from you soon.

Yvonne W.



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Nov. 23
From Jonny M,

thanks for the mail, have been busy with work last couple of days. You can quote me in your blog no problem. The session where he talked about the debt was a q and a session from the audience just in case that makes any difference. He also talked about a small house they bought which turned out to be a landfill site unknown to them, but after various core samples on the last one they found good ground, kept the plot and were offered 3 times the amount for it, thought this may be of interest. He also expressed an interest in N Ireland, perhaps this was after the afternoon collection came to around $50000! Thanks



J McM



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Nov. 23
Reply to Jonny M,

Jonny M,

Thanks for your permission to quote you in the blog and I really do appreciate the information.

I don't know anything about the house situation. He may have been speaking about a house he bought for his family but I wouldn't know anything about his personal finances. It is an interesting story though.

As to N. Ireland, I can't say what his interests are there either but I do know his Mosaic Alliance is growing and has many members in foreign countries all over the world.

Do you know what the $50,000 was raised for? Was it an honorarium for Erwin McManus himself or a donation to one of his organizations? (Mosaic or Awaken?) I'm a little curious as to where the money went.

Thanks again for reading my blog and responding.

Yvonne W.


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To My Readers,

I had never heard the story about "the house on the toxic waste site" before but I've been told by people who attended Mosaic that this is a common anecdote told by Erwin McManus. Apparently, this incident happened back when Erwin was still in Texas (long before he came on as Pastor of the Church on Brady/Mosaic) and the piece of property in question was a vacant lot purchased by the congregation he was a part of. The property was bought without the precaution of an environmental study and when the congregation sought to build on it, the problem of toxic waste was discovered. This rendered the lot useless and a total economic loss since it could not be resold.

After waiting for a period of time (and several core samples later) the lot was eventually declared free of contamination and the congregation sold the property at a profit.

If anyone knows more about this story or has a correction, please add your input here in the comments section.



Yvonne W.